The Concept and the Reality

Hey - if we didn't ALL suck at grace-living Jesus wouldn't have had to die. But, you know it's really easy to endorse a CONCEPT - but it's really hard to live it out. When sin has a face, then we discover what is really in our hearts. I know a couple that would probably be really hard-line anti-gay...if their son wasn't gay... Now, they still see the lifestyle as sinful, but they love their son so very much... I love the concept of grace...I still suck at offering it, at living it... But I have my moments. We all do. What are we going to do? Give up? Nah - that's too easy.

Cross bearing. That's what we do. That means dying to ourselves...daily...

So....

I say a lot of things I don't really mean. I try so hard to be genuine, but I suck at it (the suck factor is not only in my church - it's also in my life). Here's an (one of the many) example.

I talk all the time about showing grace, forgiveness, mercy, love, acceptance, and some more grace for the fun of it . I talk about grace all the time. I say some radical things - I say that I would let a murderer, gay, or rapist teach my kids Sunday school class. I talk a lot about grace. There's a kid who works with my youth group. (I said some very UN-graceful things) (Suffice it to say that he sinned - majorly) I can't show him grace. It kills me to see him around the girls in youth group. It makes me angry that he is allowed to be a student still. If he was gay he wouldn't be allowed to stay - but his major sexual mistake is easily forgiven. Even written off. It makes me angry.

I talk about grace more than primetime TV ... but when it comes right down to it - I can't live it. I suck at this whole grace thing.

Sin and Marriage...and...whatever...

So...I'll do one better on the whole sin/marriage issue (maybe).

There's a case in New York right now. A polygamist is on trial. Now, he's on trial, in part, for marrying a 14 year-old. Most people would say that SHOULD be illegal...but the Bible doesn't. So, is it wrong?

And the Bible indicates all kinds of godly men who had more than one wife.

Illegal? Should it be? Is it somehow morally wrong? Why? Who does it hurt? I mean, they really love each other and...well, you get the picture.

Nothing is simple. Moral and ethical questions were never meant to be easy...

What would Jesus do? What DID Jesus do? Hmmm....

Hot Metal Bridge

Okay - so these guys are my heroes...but go to their discussion board. Great stuff...

http://cybermessageboard.fatcow.com/hotmet/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=6fcfe543968744ee491ad2e789805703

Well...Jesus was...a-political, in a way, and a revoultionary in a bigger way...

Any church that tells its members how to vote isn't a church at all - it's a political organization... Don't get me started...

Having said that - EVERY church member should be involved in the political process. We should vote for the candidates according to our conscience and even run for office...

But I don't think that any of us should presume to speak for God in the political process. The Bible is pretty clear about one thing: Republicans need to recognize that God put Clinton in the White House and Democrats need to recognize that God put George Bush in the White House (Romans 13).

I will respectfully disagree with you, Michael, when you write:

People who are opposed to gay marriage have a strong scriptural backing. I think that they twist the scripture, that wether it is a sin or not those sinners are still people - loved by God and legally they should be allowed to marry.

I'm not sure what "un-twisted" Scriptures support gay-marriage? I'll need some enightenment... So, sin is okay because we're loved by God? I'm pretty sure that Jesus would have said no thank you to the cross if that really were the case? So, if you're insisting that it is not sin...well, we're opening that can of worms again...which is okay with me...

Having said all of that, I support the idea that our government should probably recognize homosexual couples equal to hetrosexual (non-married) couples... Really, what's the difference? Tax breaks (if any exist), insurance benefits, property settlements, etc. THAT, I support - it's a human rights issue. But gay marriage, I don't support. I'm not being hypocritical. Marriage is not just a legal status - but it is a spirtual status as well. If the government wants to create a legal status for homosexuals to...be a legal couple...fine. But, don't force that on the church, thank you very much. I will fight with every breath in my body to see that people are treated with justice and dignity - but I won't back down on sin just because society wants me to.

You want a less than clear sin issue? What if a man wants to marry his biological mother? Or a father his daughter (say he's 50 and she's 30)? Is it legal? Is it sin? "Everything is permissible" Paul wrote...but not everything is beneficial (I Corinthians 6 & 10 - where he talks about being mastered by food and lust). Can we do whatever we want? Yep - does that make it right?

But, back to politics (one of the three things you're never supposed to discuss at a dinner party):

Here's one of my favorite comments on the church and politics:

Derek Webb

A King & A Kingdom

(vs. 1) who's your brother, who's your sister

you just walked past him

i think you missed her

as we're all migrating

to the place where our father lives

'cause we married in to a family of immigrants

(chorus) my first allegiance is not to a flag, a country, or a man

my first allegiance is not to democracy or blood

it's to a king & a kingdom

(vs. 2) there are two great lies that i've heard:

the day you eat of the fruit of that tree,

you will not surely die and that Jesus Christ

was a white, middle-class republican

and if you wanna be saved you have to learn to be like Him

(chorus)

(bridge) but nothing unifies like a common enemy

and we've got one, sure as hell

but he may be living in your house

he may be raising up your kids

he may be sleeping with your wife

oh no, he may not look like you think

How much involvment should Christians have in politics?

I'm thinking right now about the Chechnya situation. I personally feel that the Kremlin is refusing to give Chechnya up because of the oil in that region. The war is horrible for the Russian people and it makes life unsafe for people in the cities. Everyone is in danger of the terrorist attacks. If the country was given up then the terrorist attacks would stop ... for a little while. It would clue the terrorists into the fact that terrorism is effective. But, some compromise must be possible. Also, the Kremlin hasn't been very honest. I'm in the group of outsiders who think that Anna Politaskaya was murdered by the Kremlin for her views on the Chechnyan war.

So, as a Christian how do I respond? Do I keep quite on the issue and focus instead on saving souls? Do I present a more wholistic view of Christianity by fighting for peace and equal rights? Do I support the safety and comfort of the upper class (the group I want to work with) by supporting massive military efforts? It's a lot easier when it comes to American politics because any church worth it's salt tells you how to vote.(sarcasm) It's a lot more complicated when there aren't other Christians arguing the finer points.

The Chechnyan people want indpendence, the russian government wants the natural resources and the right to say that they have defeated terrorism, and the russian people want safety and security. Where would Christ stand on such an issue?

Would I still be presenting the Gospel if my political stance goes against a people group's right to self governance in favor of a corrupt government ruling for a foreign people? I believe that Jesus Christ brings freedom - and I think that the Chechnyan people deserve freedom. But, am I willing to be murdered for that?

I read some poems written by my great-great-grandmother's cousin, John Greenlief Whittier, this afternoon. One of them was about a woman who walked into a southern church in sack-cloth and ashes because it supported slavery. She was beaten with a whip in a public parade for her beliefs. It's great to stand up and say that you are willing to die for Christ, but what about the things that Christ would support that aren't very popular.

Slave owners had scripture to back up their right to own slaves. Would I have been able to go against scripture and stand against slavery? People who are opposed to gay marriage have a strong scriptural backing. I think that they twist the scripture, that wether it is a sin or not those sinners are still people - loved by God and legally they should be allowed to marry. Am I willing to die for that? Am I willing to fly against 2000 years of scripture and history to make a stand for what I think Christ would support? Would I have the courage of that woman in sack cloth and ashes with nothing but an unpopular cause and the knowledge that scripture is never intended as hate speech to hold onto - would I have the courage to do the things she did?

Or will I continue to wonder how much involvment Christians should have in politics?

Out on a Limb?

Oh no - I won't share no blog with no feminist...
Okay - you can stay, just lay off the radical statements.

Wait a minute. Women are people too? Valued as individuals? Image of God? Equal in rights to men? Um...okay...where's the feminist part?

Paul, who was perhaps more chauvistic than Bob Jones, even wrote that in Christ there is neither MALE nor FEMALE. Sounds like equal rights to me. Maybe men and women should have different roles in, say, child rearing or household management, but honestly - where in the Bible does it say inferior?

Oh - the guys like the "wives submit to your husbands" part - forgetting that RIGHT before that Paul wrote "submit yourselves to ONE ANOTHER" and missing the whole "husbands love your wives as Christ loved the church..." He freaking died for the Church - set His EVERYTHING aside for US. Husbands, do that for your wives... No, really, it's in there...

The part about modern feminism that I don't like is the "Men are worthless" part - it's just reverse-oppression - we used to be oppressed - but now we have power so we will become the oppressors... I don't like the whole idea that men and women are entirely equal. Now, before you crucify me, hear me out. There are biological differences that we can't deny - women bear children - I wouldn't want that even if I could do it. I'm a wimp, no doubt about it. Men are less likely to nurturing, more likely to be physically stronger. Women are more likely to be relational. There are a lot of differences, most of them are not absolutes (I'm more relational than some women I know, for example) but there are differences. We aren't just "exactly the same under the skin." NOTE - that I won't insist that one is better - I'd give the edge to women if you pushed me, frankly. I don't like womanist theology - I forget her name but she made the statement that "a man dying on a cross is NOT sufficient for her salvation." Basically, no man can make a sacrifice for her - it has to be a woman...or something...

So - you're really talking about good old fashioned Christianity - before we church people got involved and mucked it all up...

Oh - hey, lay off the pipe though. C.S. Lewis didn't realize that Jesus wouldn't smoke - remember, Lewis started out as an athiest...

I got reprimanded for smoking my pipe and being a feminist today.

I don't know which one to be more upset about. I got in trouble for smoking my pipe in a public place (it was the wrong "venue"). (Sarcasm voice) Jesus spoke so movingly on the notion that if you are going to sin you should do it in private. (Sarcasm voice - fin) RA's go out drinking and go to parties with alcohol present without any moral problems. I can smoke as long as it's in a cemetary or somewhere that no one will see me. Although I have no moral problem with smoking a pipe (C.S. Lewis did it ... which makes it okay) that doesn't matter. True Christians (trademark, copyright) don't smoke.

"Well, as a child of God you should remove those thoughts and fill your mind instead with the word of God." - an administrator in response to feminism.

Honestly, feminism is the radical notion that women are people. How dare we think such thoughts. I wouldn't be suprised at all if Professor Thomas is brought in for an interogation to see what she is teaching us. We aren't talking modern feminism ... just traditional feminism. (Women are people, they are not property, a woman does not have to get married to be successful, women can go to work and deserve to get paid the same as a man.) Does this really contradict scripture. (Sarcasm voice) I'm going to go find a woman who will submit to my authority and beat her. (Sarcasm voice - fin)

You have no idea how much I want to keep that last post as the top post on this site. It almost made me spit out a glass of water - Hollywood style!

I have been wondering why I want Methodism to survive. I mean, honestly - as long as it's "kingdom building" I should support it wholeheartedly, right? One of the best things about the United Methodist church is that I can go to any UMC in the country and I will get (more or less) the same message. At a liberal church they might refer to Our Mother/Father/Parent God/Godess ... at a conservative church they might refer to AIDS as the "cure" for homosexuality. (Sadly enough I have experienced the second, my youth pastor :-( sadly enough.) But, when you get right down to the important stuff - the stuff that changes lives - it's always there. A gay AIDS patient can experience the saving grace of our Mother/Father/Parent God in any of our churches. I believe that with all of my heart. That's why I can proudly proclaim methodism even though it's fashionable to say claim a disdain for denominations.

Too many people make a big deal over refusing the idea of denominations. Sure, I think we should work together to build the kingdom, but I also like some level of consistancy. It's too easy to twist the words of God. Too many cults exist that feed off the notion that denominations are bad. Non-denominational is now an official denomination. I like having a clear set of doctrines that I can use for guidance when I'm not sure what the Bible says. It drives my friends crazy when I quote the UM book of discipline. It drives me equally crazy when they quote some guy's opinion as Gospel just because he gets paid to think about Jesus.

That's right. I'm a denominationalist. I like it.

Sometimes You Wanna Go Where Everybody Knows Your Name...

So I was at a Healthy Communities/Healthy Youth meeting once (yeah, one of those wierd age-based service organizations) where we talked about what young people wanted and what kind of goals HC/HY should set. We had with us about 7-8 middle school/high school kids - mostly of the "skater" crowd... Well, the details don't really matter...

One of the things the kids said that they really wanted in the community was a place. Some kind of place where they would be welcome and not looked down on and not pushed aside. They wanted a place where people of all ages could interact with each other. A place where everybody respected everybody and where young and old alike had equal voice and equal space.

And I said: I know just such a place...



It's called....







MYSPACE!





Sigh...that's probably true, you know...

But my FIRST thought was, really, that's the church. That's EXACTLY what the church is. An intergenerational place where...and then it hit me. That's what church SHOULD be...but, sadly, isn't.

But it can be. We can do it. We just need to look more at (and like) Jesus and less at (and like) each other. We need to live what we belive - not just say it (and sometimes we don't even say it). We need to be that place where EVERYBODY has voice, place...it's home...

I began thinking about the SMFOYAYP (Shared Mission Focus on Youth and Young People). They tried to define what age groups were considered youth and young adults. In some African countries where the life expectancy is 30 an 8 year old is considered a youth. In some asiatic nations a 35 year old is a young adult. So ... we have a division that deals with age-based ministries ... focusing on people between the ages of 8 and 35! HA.

I have heard of several 11 year olds who have threatened suicide. Kids are "coming out of the closet" at the age of 10 according to Time magazine. I think it's about time that the American church begins re-thinking our youth ministries. There isn't a magical number - no magical age at which a person starts dealing with youth issues. So how do we address the needs of an 8 year old who is already smoking pot and a 35 year old who still is? How do we effectively bring Christ to the 9 year old without a mother and the 30 year old mother who lost her 9 year old?

I don't agree with the principle of "age based ministry." I go the older adult class. I work with children's ministries over the summer. I go to a middle-aged bible study on Wednesdays. I go to youth group on Sunday Nights. I feel fed and fulfilled at all of these gatherings. I belive and strongly support an intergenerational view of ministry. I want more 80 year old women working with the youth and more teens going to the older adult Sunday School class.

Church People

You know, I swear that our custodian would come to church if he wasn't around church people all week.

We have a really busy church. Parishioners stop in all the time. Not every churchgoer, it turns out, is kind, or patient, or any of the other things Paul writes about in 1 Corinthians 13 and Galatians 5.

We've got a huge building to...um...custode? Um, anyway - it's a big building. And Bob does most of the upkeep himself. When he gets criticism for a cobweb, or bad droppings on the pews or whatever - well, it's almost never spoken in love...

Yeah, I think he'd come to church if it wasn't for all the churchpeople...

The Peanuts cartoon yesterday played off a Dostoeyevsky piece. One told another he wanted to be a doctor, the other told him he couldn't because he hated humanity, and the first reminded the other that he didn't hate humanity ... just people.

In The Brothers Karamazhov it is a missionary doctor who is talking. He says, "The more I love humanity in general the more I hate people in particular." He goes on to talk about how he can't live with people - ever. Well, that's me. I have the hardest time living with people. My roomate left his music on this morning after leaving for work. Who leaves music on while another person is asleep. Since I don't know the password to his computer I can't turn it off now while I work on homework.

I get upset at the guys I live with all the time. I was so frustrated by the antics of Yanic and Jonathan. (Honestly, now that I have moved out I love them both and miss them a great deal... but, when we shared a room it was hell.) Now, I know that I don't have major problems relating to people. I have a huge number of very close friends. I have a great number of people who I feel as close to as a brother or a sister ... so why can't I live with anyone?

I think that the next person I room with (if any) needs to be someone who takes criticism really well. It needs to be someone who I can confront rationally and he will accept it and change. Superhuman. Of course, why didn't I think of that first.

All Around Me, Every Day

Yeah - it gets better. We're in "Ordinary Time" - so this is either:

The 23rd week after Pentecost (or Pentecost +23)

Ordinary 32

Proper 27

Sounds like the church, doesn't it? Make things really boring, rigid, but with important sounding titles. Proper 27 - oooo...

But the Holy Spirit has been working in amazing ways this summer, even though we don't "schedule" the Spirit to do so... I just got a report of a man who is seeking treatment for alcoholism. There's a couple families working through some pretty big betrayals - but they're doing it together. There's a young couple that I know who, despite having everything working against them and nearly everyone working against them, they are fighting to make it together. And, let's face it, the sun rose every morning, we had breath in our lungs, light in our eyes, hope in our hearts.

The Holy Spirit may not be too acknowledged in our labels, but I won't deny the Spirit's work all around me every day.

The Twenty-Third Sunday after Pentecost? Doesn't that just make it seem like nothing happened after the Holy Spirit showed up? I mean, really. Twenty-three weeks without any major, life-changing events? Sounds like my life. Sounds like my school.

We had a woman come and speak at chapel. Landa L. Cope is her name. She isn't a pastor (she's lecturing - not preaching; although, there is a distinct lack of Bible and Theology Profs present in chapel this week), but she does have short spikey hair. She also might be un-married (which makes her unfit to talk about families - we'll pretend that Jesus was married and that's why he had the authority to speak about marriage.)

She's an amazing speaker. She's liberal and funny. She laughs like a smoker and is filled with the Holy Spirit. I'm exstatic. I went and talked with my associate pastor for 2 hours about chapel, today. We had a great discussion about my being at such a conservative school and our mutual lack of compassion for those who have no compassion.

I see a lot of people who think that they are stellar Christians who also suck at being a Christian. I've really been hoping that I don't fall into that category. I really want to move off campus. I want to start the "college Sunday lunch" ministry back up - and we need a house for that. I also want to invite people from church over for meals to foster a greater attitude of fellowship.

So, I'm mister random-post again today. But, at least I'm happy and feel that God is working in the world and in me again. I had missed that a lot.

The Twenty-Third Sunday After Pentecost

You know it's funny, I've always found the by following the lectionary, I actually am able to connect my messages with the life of the congregation better than if I just preach on whatever strikes my fancy. But that's probably just because I almost completely rely on God when I'm writing a sermon - because I don't have any real wisdom or insight, but God does. It also often happens that whatever I'm preaching about is something that *I* need to hear. And if I need to hear something, it's a pretty good bet that someone else does too.

Here's what I think is happening. You're getting preached things that these pastors think you're supposed to hear instead of things they're supposed to say. Know what I mean? I can see the pastor in his study (I mean this is a really conservative place, so you don't hear from women, do you?) with is Bible open going, "Okay, I'm going to preach to a bunch of 18-21 year olds. What do they need to hear? Hmmm, well, I bet their hormones are raging - let's see..." Opens up Bible to some "good" Old Testament and Pauline fornication passages. "Yep, this'll stop 'em."

So, the Lectionary. This week one of the readings is from Mark 12:38-44:
"As he taught, Jesus said, 'Watch out for the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and be greeted in the marketplaces, and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets. They devour widow's houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severly.' Jesus sat down opposite the place where hte offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. But a poor widow came and put in two very small copper coins, worth only a fraction of a penny. Calling his disciples to him, Jesus said, 'I tell you the truth, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. They all gave out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything - all she had to live on."

Okay - in my congregation this plays really easily - we've got a wealthy congregation, most of whom give without really thinking, give out of their surplus. And many give with an attitude of what a great gift they're giving to the church. So I've got plenty of material in the widow's mite part - but the self-righteousness section could play easily here, too.

So - what would I say to the college age demographic? Well, I'd really tailor it to being authentic. The problem with the "teachers of the law" is that their PROJECTION of who they think the world sees (the long robes, the prayers) doesn't match either the reality of their hearts or the reality of their actions (what the world REALLY sees) - they devour widows' houses. Same with the rich people THROWING (there's a bunch of good stuff about this action) their offering into the treasury. It's about being real. It's about what you show the world really being what's in your heart. If you want to work in a point about raging hormones, go ahead. But in the larger context of the TRUTH of God's relationship with us and our relationships with each other. About being transparent. But also about grace - I can't say that I've never stood up in front of people and said, basically, "Look at me. Look how profound I can be." Or whatever. We all fall into the trap of being inauthentic - fake - hypocrites...

That's off the cuff - and I didn't even use the Ruth passage (which would probably play right into the raging hormones thing)...

My point is just that ANY passage of scripture can be applied to where we are - this is the LIVING word of God, after all. And without twisting it and bending it to OUR agendas.

We never hear sermons about "the college kid who started doing laundry and ran out of money before his clothes were dry." (As opposed to the man who started building his house and ran out of money and resources before he was finished.)

We never hear sermons that directly apply to us. Everyone is stressed and freakin' out about tests, but Christ's admonishing us not to worry, words of direct pertinance, are rarely used. Everyone is tired and most of us are hungry, but all of the words that we need to hear are rarely spoken.

We are instead preached to about: abortion, gay marriage, sex-before-marriage, and a host of other issues that have a vague resonance with most college kids at a conservative Christian college. They are preaching to the choir, daily. And, they don't really get it - it isn't enough. It doesn't nourish us.

I hope that pastors are continually reminded to worry less about preaching by the lectionary and are more concerned with what concerns their congregation. Man centered, yes. But, Christ thought it was an okay approach.

The Church of the Upper Class

Somebody looked around First Church and realized that there aren't any poor people here. Well, the truth is we've got a few "token" poor people, but no "real" poor people here. This is a white collar church - and it seems like those are the only kind of people who come here.

Sigh...

I just had a conversation with another pastor. He had a call from a woman who was asking really strange questions about church. "Do I have to make a reservation to come?" "Where will I sit?" "What if I don't have any money to put in the plate?" "Do I have to come every Sunday?"

She had no idea what church is.

Most days I have no idea what church SHOULD be. No, that's not true - I know what it should be, but I can't see it. We play a lot of church games, we do a lot of church stuff, but when was the last time we really WERE the church?

I see it sometimes when there's a tragedy - a death (funerals are notorious for bringing out the best AND the worst in people - but I've really seen the church at some funeral services), 9/11, a family is burned out of their home and people pull together and open themselves up to each other.

Unless they're really poor, maybe. Or annoying. Or not as smart as the rest of us. Or rude. Yeah, rude is bad...

Sigh...

I'm in a bad mood today. We spent four hours supposedly talking about shared ministry in Warren - without making one real decision, without drawing a single conclusion or even a single idea of what we really CAN do. Except that we neet to meet again in a few weeks.


Sigh...

You know, Maya Angelou would be SO welcome here - as long as she sat quietly in her pew - but she better not speak out. That would never fly...

Sadly, that's true in most churches. And I, too, don't think she'd be interested at all in attending most churches...